Excommunicate Me
March 10, 2009 - 4:11pm (Print)
If there is no room in the Catholic Church for doctors who would provide an abortion to a nine-year-old incest survivor pregnant with twins, but plenty of space for the girl's stepfather, who raped her, then there is no room for me, Brazilian Catholics are saying. A petition site (in Portuguese) will send the names of Catholics who ask for excommunication in solidarity with the doctors and the girl's family members to the Archbishop of Recife, Jose Cardoso Sobrinho. (The Archbishop did not mention excommunicating the girl's stepfather.)
According to the Archbishop, abortion is categorically worse than killing an adult person, because the "adult may or may not be an innocent, but an unborn child is most definitely innocent. Taking that life cannot be ignored." I suppose that ambivalence towards death encompasses forcing a no-longer-presumed-innocent nine-year-old to bring a life-threatening pregnancy to term and idly standing by as the consequences play out.
I don't see how anyone can honestly be associated with a religion that practices this kind of behavior. I think that speaks volumes about them as human beings.
No room for me either.
But I would still like to be excommunicated. How would I go about doing that?
I'm not Catholic, either--but I want to be excommunicated for supporting this child's mother and doctors.
Thanks Emily,
I pleased to see that so many people in a Catholic country recognise the essential injustice of this peculiar 'morality' playing out in such a grotesque manner.
I find the reasoning bizarre, it's OK to force a 9 year old rape victim to to carry twins to term even though doing so might kill her because she is or may be insufficiently 'innocent'? What does that mean? How is it 'pro-life' to value potential life more than actual life?
Why is it worse to save her life than to rape her for three years and impregnate her?
I am so glad to hear about the petition. I'm still waiting for those jackasses to rescind their original statement about how the little girl should just carry TWINS to term then get a c-section (like 93% of Brazilian WOMEN do). I think I will be waiting a long, long time.
Nine years old. Nine.
Why give credence to the idea that the Bishops have the right to excommunicate anyone for what they believe about abortion or for having one or for performing one? While it has media appeal,it just gives the bishops too much power. If you don't want to stay in the church and fight to change it. Leave, Leave publicly but on your own steam -
Is a Patriarical business. The business is keeping the traditional family coming to church and filling their coffers with money. Women who belong to this religion don't realize that they are contributing to keeping themselves imprisoned...much like the Taliban in Afganistan. Imprisoned having child after child, with no caring or understanding coming from the women hating Bishops, priests, Monks, and Popes. Get out while you can. For the children whose lives were ruined by being raped by priests, by the stern hand of Patriarchy that sees women as nothing more than breeding machines, and even little girls now! Then again, is that such a stretch? A religion that uses young boys for sexual pleasure, and protects these criminals, can also see children as breeders. I could not think less of them, after this story. They have a lot of nerve, and that is putting it nicely.
hear you say that.
I understand and agree completely...
My My! Such big teeth you have, Grandma! Seriously, the wickedness is rather thick in the room here, so here we go.
This pregnancy situation is tragic. But why make it worse? You know, as screwed up as people are, the only healing that can ever really work is forgiveness, not revenge, and love, not hate. Period. Whatever anyone thinks of the Catholic Church, it has this going for it: Love.
And it's Truth. I know it , 'cause I've tasted it. It is real, and it's sweet.
Stop spitting cobra venom, and wake up.
Help the world, dont hurt it.
Where's the LOVE- or is that the pedophilia you're talking about?
Yes, you are missing something. No , it's not pedophilia, or any other scandal that men and women are known to produce. It's God reaching down into our screwed up world, and giving us all second chances through his Church, in which he has entrusted frail people to continue to provide the medicine for a damaged and lost world. This Church will continue to be the teacher, and voice of God long after we both are gone, and we will both look back on this and laugh, I bet ya.
Ah yes, "this Church" God's instrument on this planet-don't think so. This Church has been formed by the very frail men (and of course I do mean men) who have screwed up so royally- killing millions, innocent men, women and children, even men women and children of the church itself- all in the name of the "Church"
And we are to believe that this Church, ruled and made by these men- that's the embodiment of God on this planet?
No thanks, I think trees and birds are more an embodiment of God on this earth than your corrupt EVIL church.
Yup, I missed the Koolaid line, but you obviously drank my share.
Dear "missed the Koolaid".
It has come to our attention that you have missed the Koolaid. This oversight must not be allowed to stand.
You are to report to your local RCC chapter for futher instructions. The "wild cherry" flavor is to be given highest priority, since it packs the most "wallop".
Education portion will follow promptly.
Topics to be covered will include:
RCC's role in raising women's status in the Middle East in the early centuries A.D.
RCC's role in preserving the learning and libraries of the ancient cultures of Greece, and Rome.
RCC's role in encouraging and developing science, especially astronomy, and biology, as well as agricultural yield studies, improving crops and farming practices in the Middle Ages.
RCC's role in promoting and preserving the arts, especially in the Middle Ages.
RCC's role in providing protection, education, jobs, to the local citizenry.
RCC's role in saving millions of lives through medical houses, hostelries, orphanages, mental institutions, serving the poor, those in prison, the sick, the elderly, etc.
RCC's role in brokering peace between nations, as was done recently through world wars and conflicts up to the present day, providing the platform and means to remove the "iron curtain" which threatened Russia and the world with nuclear war, and other atrocities.
RCC's role in standing up for the voiceless in the prisons in China, Saudia Arabia, North Korea, and Rwanda.
RCC's role today speaking up for the defenseless around the world in all shapes, sizes, colors.
But, of course, I'm afraid nothing can be done untill you drink the Koolaid.
More to follow-it's late- but
most of this is such general Church BS and platitudes that it means nothing.
But just to start the discussion before I head off to bed- I DIDN"T miss the:
RCC Crusades- killing millions of women and children (heck men too), and forever causing the breakdown of relgious tolerance in the Middle East;
The RCC instigation of the Inquisition, killing hundreds of thousands of Jews, gypsies and other assorted "non-Catholics";
The RCC "converting" and killing millions of native americans, destroying a highly civilized society in both N and S America;
The RCC witch trials- instigated by the RCC both in Europe and N America. Ah , but that mostly killed only women- no big deal;
The RCC collaboration with the Nazis to kill even more Jews during WW2, helping the war criminals escape and then helping them survive in S America. Oh and I forgot- getting rich at the same time on confiscated Jewish and non-Catholic treasure;
THe RCC Holocaust in Croatia and the millions of deaths of Serbs- resulting in ethnic divisions which last to this day;
The RCC fight against contraceptives- especially condoms- resulting in hundreds of thousands of deaths from Aids;
The RCC protecting thousands of priests who abused children- over decades (and then using parishners hard earned dollars to settle those cases);
The RCC and the Madgdelen sisters abusing thousands of orphans;
I could go on and on- and give you citations and pictures, court documents- you name it- but it really is useless
I'm not even going to go through your list of "good" things the RCC does, really, it's just a bunch of words nothing to back it up.I'll just take two examples you give:
"RCC's role today speaking up for the defenseless around the world in all shapes, sizes, colors".
I missed how they spoke up for this defenseless little 9 year old. Was she the wrong color??Were the Jews the wrong color? Are women the wrong color? The wrong shape? Something?????
Or let's try another:
"RCC's role in raising women's status in the Middle East in the early centuries A.D."
You are kidding right? What, they raised women out of the mud- so they could serve men??The Church made darn sure that they went right back to the teachings of the oldtestament- including going so far as to change passages in the new testament. Just to assure themselves that women were deemed subordinate to men. And of by the way, we've made a lot of progress on that score in your church- righto! !
Dr. Thought Police is a good name for you- the RCC has your number and you have certainly drunk an ocean of their Koolaid.
is what religion can do, and your post is a perfect example of that. The Love?? How is trying to punish a 9 year old for the sins of her victimizer LOVE? How is rampant molestation by Priests on innocent children who trusted them love? If these are your ideas of LOVE, then you have a very warped interpretation of what love is! Stop sucking the kool aid and wake the heck UP!
Why I don't beleive in a god?
With people like them in charge,they make it so easy,not to beleive in one.
How wonderful that ordinary people within the church are fighting back with moral indignation. The RCC, with all it's problems, is an embedded mainstay whether we like it or not. It's a wealthy, powerful institutuion. However, I believe Catholics can make a positive impact within the church or by leaving it. Whatever choice is most acceptable to the RCC member is acceptable for me. They are already creating an alternative community within the church by standing in solidarity with the nine-year old victim, her family, and healthcare providers.
Great idea! If only all pro-choice Catholics would excommunicate
themselves, we could cut the size and power of the Church by two-thirds
overnight!
Since the pregnancy was life-threatening, the
fetuses were definitely NOT innocent. There are 2 meanings to that
word, it does not mean in this case that there's any ill intent, it
just means that the fetuses were endangering her health and life, and
that entitles her to defend herself with an abortion.
Btw, by
refuting this "innocent fetus" argument from anti-choicers, as well as
their usually unquestioned assumption that fetuses are full human
beings with rights, anti-choicers are essentially left with no
arguments at all to support their view.
As an ex-Catholic I must wonder why anyone remains in the church, especially anyone who cannot go along with the pope on birth control.
Period.
There is no room for me either - the step father should rot slow..
This poor, poor little girl...I can't imagine what this whole ordeal is going to do to her...not only to be raped, abused, and impregnated, but then to have an abortion and to have her family excommunicated...poor baby.
"Well behaved women seldom make history."-Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
